Author Topic: MATSUMOKU and the HB-35 (Read 168876 times)

nogin007 · « **Reply #15 on:** September 14, 2009, 08:40:31 AM »

TK, if I were to make a guess as to the difference in serial numbers, I would guess that Washburn changed manufacturers. My Tacoma built D46 Cheyenne has a 4 digit serial, using Tacomas system. Some have posted pictures of their D46's that had the long serial numbers, after Washburn moved production from Tacoma. Of course, that's just a guess on my part.

Racing · « **Reply #16 on:** September 14, 2009, 12:19:01 PM »

Funny seing this thread...
Looks like i just bought me an -83 vintage Washburn Force 4 bass.
Going to be interesting to rip it apart as it shows up.
Speaking of Yamaki,Matsu asf..

Gitfiddle · « **Reply #17 on:** September 14, 2009, 04:37:08 PM »

I just had a long discussion with the luthier. I have been searching forums and ads and Wiki for weeks trying to make sure I got the right pickups for my J6 (it's expensive). Well it devolves down to this: IF you were designing the J6 today WHAT would be the right pickups. Well it comes to Seymour Duncan Seth Lover being a choice that is NOT WRONG..

OK dropped it off. $330 out the door -- new SD Seth Lover new covers all set up to spec. Done in about 3 weeks.

Tio Kimo · « **Reply #18 on:** September 14, 2009, 07:59:39 PM »

so, bringing this back around...what do we know.

Racing...do you believe that Uncle Mat made HB's for Washburn? Ever seen em? Ever heard your compadres talking about them? What about Yamaki?

As to the serial numbers...the one facet that was intended to address this issue...there are 4 digit and 6 digit guitars. gitfiddle has a J6 which is VERY similar to mine in finish, with a 4 digit number, bought new in 88. 1984HB35 owns a guitar exactly like minewith a 4 digit number, and he's under the impression it's a Matsumoku. With enough input from owners, we should be able to start to narrow this down.

I happen to own a Yamaki Acoustic from 1981 which has a 6 digit number beginning with 1...

so the question is, what was the system being used by Mat and Yamaki, is there any consistancy between styles and SN's??

Gitfiddle · « **Reply #19 on:** September 15, 2009, 10:12:25 AM »

I agree with you Tio. The 1988 has the Gibson-like tailpiece and the Korean made ones have a different style of tailpiece. (I view mine as a Gibson clone) The workmanship is fantastic. Without flaw. The sunburst finish is flawless. They guitar is now vintage. I see so few of them that I think we who own them are less than a few hundred at best. Possibly less than 100. (I said to the luthier yesterday where do old guitars go? he said he wonders too -- where do the thousands of guitars sold by GC go? You never see thme again) Do they get trashed? So we own a rare item. (and a superb rare item)

Racing · « **Reply #20 on:** September 15, 2009, 02:30:30 PM »

Well,what we THINK we have figured out is the serial sequence for the other Mats.(Aria/Vantage/Epi asf)
5 digit means itÂ´s a 70s issue,and the first digit denoted what yr.

80s are either 6 or 7.

Now...enter the Washburns.

Would have been easy enough to state that they work the same way,but this is where I will cast my vote and say that is not always true.
Of course the difference between the Yamakis and Mats,but thereÂ´s more to it than that.
The Yamaki Eagles et al seem to follow a given pattern.(Highend Wings)
Thing is that some of the ravens dont.
IÂ´ve even seen them sans serial completely-just with the Washburn logo engraved into the neckplate.
So...honestly...i cast my vote as dunno.

Take the Force4 bass i just bought.
I happen to know the guy,and he bought that bass before his oldest daugther was born-which was in 86-and if we were to go by the numbers...it would be an 88 as the first digit is an....you guessed it...8

However,the first TWO digits are 83-which would be conclusive with when the bass i case was bought by Mike.
A system iÂ´ve encountered on other Yamaki built guitars.

Then...my BBR super tele,which i suspect to be Yamaki,that carries a serial that starts with a 5...and i absolutely guarantee that no other conclusions can be made from the serial.
My old HM-5 same deal.

As for if Matsumoku made HBs...again,your guess is as good as mine,but i for one would find it very plausible.
Have in mind that it was until quite recently that the highend Wings were denoted as being Matsumoku....until the likes of G3H asf started pulling the numbers.
I guess what iÂ´m saying is that between the two that we KNOW were in bed with each other through Washburn alone...chances are that they indeed were on other guitars than the Wings.
Or,more to the point,most likely even.

Please donÂ´t get me wrong here,cause personaly i couldnÂ´t give less of a flying who made what from that regard(player factor) as they BOTH made fantastic instruments.
Just..history is sometimes interesting.

Tio Kimo · « **Reply #21 on:** September 15, 2009, 02:50:08 PM »

quote:
Originally posted by Racing

Please donÂ´t get me wrong here,cause personaly i couldnÂ´t give less of a flying who made what from that regard(player factor) as they BOTH made fantastic instruments.
Just..history is sometimes interesting.

Ultimtely, I agree. I love my guitar. It's a great player, and I have no plans to part with it. As I said at the start of the thread, when dudes start placing price tags on them of a grand or more stating that are made by Matsumoku...well, I'm curious how that make that statement.

Thanks for the input, Racing.

wmjonson · « **Reply #22 on:** September 16, 2009, 01:37:39 AM »

Tio, A new HB-35 MIC OR MII list for almost a grand. I don't know about you but I wouldn't trade either of my HB-35's MIJ or MIK for a new one. I believe a grand is probably about the right price for the older HB-35's.

Both of my HB-35's are good players and I am completely happy with them. I am not looking to sell but I would like to know the history.

Here is an interesting article I found on Washburns, seems that they used a lot of plants in Japan.

http://www.guitarworld.com/article/washburn_guitars_burning_for_you?page=0%2C0

Racing · « **Reply #23 on:** September 16, 2009, 03:36:35 AM »

Might be,but the mention of Tarada,Ibanez(Greco-FujiGen Gakki) and Tokai hardly qualifys as conclusive.

As far as i know for instance FujiGen landed their contract with Fender for the JV series in late 80.
Ie;that done they hardly needed/could cope with more business.

..and nowhere is Matsumoku or Yamaki even mentioned.
Got a feeling that article tells us about....nothing.
Altho interesting per se.

wmjonson · « **Reply #24 on:** September 16, 2009, 11:42:57 AM »

quote:
Originally posted by Racing

Might be,but the mention of Tarada,Ibanez(Greco-FujiGen Gakki) and Tokai hardly qualifys as conclusive.

As far as i know for instance FujiGen landed their contract with Fender for the JV series in late 80.
Ie;that done they hardly needed/could cope with more business.

..and nowhere is Matsumoku or Yamaki even mentioned.
Got a feeling that article tells us about....nothing.
Altho interesting per se.

Yes Racing, that was my point both Mat and Yam being large factories it is odd that they were not mentioned if they were building Washburn's.

Gitfiddle · « **Reply #25 on:** September 16, 2009, 11:43:29 AM »

I just dropped my J6 off at the luthier for SD Seth Lovers .. when that is done I'll have slightly more than $1K in the guitar (since 1988). I'll do a fret job next year ($300). We all get set ups (after hot spells, etc.) what you PAY for a guitar is somewhere between how much it cost to make it and what the seller thinks they can get. What it is worth to you is all in the mind of the beholder (over time). So my J6 is worth WAY MORE than I paid for it. [I never wanted to sell it. (get rid of it) It's been a good relationship over 22 years]

wmjonson · « **Reply #26 on:** September 16, 2009, 11:48:53 AM »

TK, I found an old post in the forum where someone has a D-28 with the serial# 36xx. Although that is an acoustic I am curious about that serial beginning with #3.

http://forums.washburn.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14216

Tio Kimo · « **Reply #27 on:** September 16, 2009, 01:29:51 PM »

seeing that all the 4 digit serials I've seen are 8xxx, I wonder if he doesn't have a bad read on it, didn't print clearly etc, and that 3 is really an 8.

Don't know if others saw the note, Rudy, who toured and chose the factories used in the 80's, just sold US Music (Washburn).

Shame. I sat down with him for a discussion a few months back, I would've just asked the man straight up what he recalls...wasted opportunity. [

]

nogin007 · « **Reply #28 on:** September 16, 2009, 03:35:59 PM »

I have a D46, Tacoma built, that has a 4 digit serial, and the first number is 3.

wmjonson · « **Reply #29 on:** September 16, 2009, 06:43:36 PM »

quote:
Originally posted by nogin007

I have a D46, Tacoma built, that has a 4 digit serial, and the first number is 3.

What year is your guitar? I wasn't aware that Tacoma also used the 4 digit serial. Perhaps that is what the other guy has also.